This “comment du jour” by “James” was too good to pass up:
Is it me or are the comments and posters on here so much more valuable than the crap du jour on socketsite?
As Kenny said in his reply, “Totally…I feel like the point of this blog site is to try to make sense of the market, and not to TELL YOU what’s going on. That’s huge.”
I don’t know the answer to the question, but I know Kenny provided a good reply. The point here is to make sense of, educate on, and learn how to gauge this market, but also help our readers get in or out of the game of real estate. It is not to be the “anti-socketsite”, as I think SocketSite does, in fact, provide some good insight. However, real estate is a complicated game, and to be told what the market is doing by someone not actively in it (from what we can tell) is…well… a joke. You might as well take real estate tips from the Enquirer. And if you’re a Realtor, you sure as hell shouldn’t be supporting, or providing information to, a site that at one time had FSBO as a goal, clearly supports a crashing market, and freely distributes (read: poaches) information that we all pay for (think MLS), without being a member himself. But I guess some Realtors will do anything for a bit of attention now won’t they? And that’s a whole different discussion.
That’s my two cents. Thanks for the comments, and thanks for reading! Now if you just un-plug from that socket, your lights might shine a bit more brightly, we can all move on, and not have to go over this topic again.
p.s. Hi Adam.
This feuding business is a bit silly, isn’t it?
For what it’s worth, I really enjoy reading both blogs (especially the comments).
I would be on a mission too, if I worked in finance and could have bought 9 yrs ago at 30 yrs old, and didn’t.
I enjoy reading both sites. I think there are a lot of very smart people making really good observations based on facts, stats, or personal experiences in their commentaries on both. As for the ‘noise’ — the doom and gloom or ‘everything is great’ comments that are obviously based on an emotional response to the subject matter, one just has to apply what I call the “Post Modern” method of deconstructing blog comments: read for what it is, and don’t read too much into it. :)
Doom and Gloom sites will always do well. Socket site is so popular because it is negative and it (i guess) will filter out comments and censor things, esp if they are positive.
This site is really nice and positive. Sadly it will not get the traction of SocketSite because people love to look at negative news. An OJ arrest case is more important then the cure for cancer.
I disagree. I enjoy reading and participating in several real estate and architecture blogs..including Socketsite, BLDGblog, Archinect and others. they offer diverse points of view…and in fact a lot more visuals than this site.
“Socket site is so popular because it is negative and it (i guess) will filter out comments and censor things, esp if they are positive.”
FWIW I have seen a lot of positive comments about the market on Socketsite in their comment sections. I don’t perceive any filtering going on, unless it’s for language.
I also don’t feel that SS is particularly 100% negative, anymore then I feel that TFS is 100% positive. I think they each have their viewpoints, which are more nuanced then is being given credit to here. And I definitely read both sites, no question about it. I’m also going to check out the blogs Duggo mentioned, which I wasn’t aware of.
Frankly I don’t see a huge difference in the commenting, other then socketsite is more popular, so it probably attracts more non-homeowners as a percentage of readership, where on this blog it seems like many of the readers and commentors are real estate professionals. I think the industry centric viewpoint cuts both ways: obviously RE professionals have a vested interest in the market which may or may not reflect in a “pro-SF RE” bias, but as Alex correctly points out they also bring real market experience to the table, and that certainly has a lot of value.
In short, I think there is room for all to live together harmoniously, and there are plenty of interested readers such as myself that will read both blogs as they try and sort some sense out of the market.
check out CurbedSF…one of my faves.
Socketsite isn’t all one sided. There are quite a few people with “The market is bad and I’ll tell you why. It’s bad because I know it’s bad. Oh, you want proof? Here are three properties in the Excelsior that sold for 10% under last month” — that attitude. And quite a few others with the opposite viewpoint, as well as views all mixed in between.
SocketSite started very negative and has toned it down a bit, in order to not alienate advertisers. It is a business.
But, Adam is indeed a 39 year old renter, and censors posts. How on earth could he have missed over 20 record high price examples over the past two months? He hasn’t. He just chooses to focus on poor areas, and overbuilt SOMA.
Afterall, 70%+ of SF is filled with renters, so he is catering to the majority.
BoomTime/HQ/MarinaPrime/Squaw @ Tahoe buyer…. why not start your own blog?
Not Blazing – Why start my own blog when I have this great blog? :) Alex is great at highlighting real examples around the city showing what’s really going, good or bad. Direct your frustration and anger at the market, and improve yourself. It’s the only way, if you want to achieve what you want.
BoomTime
What anger? I’m a homeowner, but your shenanigans here, on craig’s list, on socketsite, and on any blog about SF real estate get old.
Precisely what makes Socket Site an interesting read is that it’s NOT written by a realtor. The viewpoint is less biased toward the self-serving “Now is the best time to buy” mentality which is consistently put forth by industry folk, no matter how unfavorable the market conditions.
[Editor’s note: I would have to disagree. Everyone has an agenda…even socketsite. And I am hardly biased. The fact is, the market is still really, really damn good. If it’s a good time for YOU to buy, buy. If not, wait. That’s always my advice. Real estate is not for everyone.]
Sorry Not Blazing – But you have the wrong person. This is the only blog i post on, but I do look at others. Donno what type of shenanigans you talk about on this board?
Would you guys take a chill pill and stop attacking each other? It is just another blog, ferchrissakes.
I sometimes think Boomtime is a paid blogger for this site :-)
[Editor’s note: He’s not paid. Nobody gets paid on this blog. Including myself. If the shenanigans keep up, there will be no more theFrontSteps. So (Booomtime and NotBlazing) take your scuffle to the bike racks and quit bitching at each other here…simple as that. And “ferchissakes” don’t take any comments personally!]
I don’t have the wrong person.
Interesting how someone who claims not to post on SocketSite would think that posts were “being banned” there:
”
BoomTime (16:42:41) :
Socketsite actually has a couple blogges on their payroll. One of which is named Badlydrawbear. You will see him posting on Socketsite to help support Adam’s opinions, and you will see him post on many other sites all day long. Adam is very clever. Socketsite also bans any posts which are deemed counter to Adam’s mission. Socketsite was very informative, but has become overly biased to the downsound, which makes it lose it’s appeal. When they start highlighting why this SOMA condo doesn’t sell for $1,200/sqft and how this SOMA condo ‘only’ sold for $1,100/sqft… it starts losing it’s credibility fast.
It is amazing how Socketsite ‘misses’ so many great examples of properties in the city selling for new record prices. I do feel sorry for Adam, renting at 39 yeas old, and his followers who’ve seemingly waited forever. Anybody trying to buy a remotely desirable property in SF is going to be in a BIG surprise about how stiff the competition is.
BoomTime”
ALEXXXXXXXXXXXXXX we need MARGUARITAS!!!!!
[Editor’s note: I would, but I’m going surfing instead. ;-) ]
“I do feel sorry for Adam, renting at 39 yeas old, and his followers who’ve seemingly waited forever. ”
I don’t understand this bias against renters somehow being failures because they choose to invest their money in other ventures besides real estate. I am a current renter, but former 2X owner in other states. There are merits to both options, it just depends on what suits one’s life best. Right now I saved a bundle by renting (thanks to rent control), have invested those savings wisely in a diversified portfolio and will reassess the value of home ownership in the city (suburbs will never be an option) when the current turmoil settles down in a couple of years.
As for Socketsite, they have a good variety of topics and a diverse user community. In addition to presenting some beautiful properties, they also have some interesting debates & article links to current market issues and local projects (i.e the TransBay terminal). They also can take the sensationalist route with current headlines and some of the posters are over the top negative. But it’s no worse than overly optimistic sites that proclaim the market is great by sensationalizing selective statistics or reports either. If there’s one thing I learned from surviving the tech bubble, it is to gather and evaluate as many facts as possible and not to give too much credence to the advice of those who stand to profit from your investment or to take shelter every time someone yells that the sky is falling. Just take everything w/ a grain of salt as the full disclosure of an individual’s perspective and motivations can never be completely known.
[Editor’s note: Ollie12, I’m going to go ahead and bold your last sentence. You hit the nail on the head.]
Well said, Ollie 12. I have a friend who manages and sells software research for a living. He’s a really savvy investor who has done great with money markets and other investments post dot-com bubble. His take is this: If everybody is talking about it, it’s likely wrong. I don’t think I subscribe to that, but there’s something to it. I remember how everybody was buying tech stock during the dot com days. My mom was buying EBay stock and stuff without doing a lot of research. Well, nowadays the opposite is happening. Lots of people who maybe aren’t doing a ton of research are hollering that the sky is falling in real estate.
In response to Ollie12,
I already bolded your comments, but wanted to add a few.
Full disclosure: I truly, honestly, don’t want to mislead readers, and i truly want to paint an accurate picture of the market. I always have. And the truth is, there are more good stories than bad, and I choose to focus on them. It paints a more accurate picture as to the way I see it, and I know I’m not alone. High lighting price reductions does not tell the story, as the majority of properties are selling within +/- 5% of original asking price. Also, I rent here in SF, but own other property in other states. I know the pros and cons to both. I think you’ll get a pretty fair view on my site.
Kudos for the kudos. It’s nice to be a part of a constructive dialogue rather than being subjected to scorn for a slightly contrarian response. It’s rare these days in the anonymous land of the Internet.
Kenny, I did well during the tech boom/bust too because I’m in the tech industry and was able to make good evaluations of tech companies and their offerings. When it comes to real estate, I’m just a typical home buyer. My factors generally come to where I think the market is (top, bottom or somewhere in between) so I can weigh my options for upgrading my housing situation in the future; is it financially advantageous and/or responsible; and whether or not my quality of life will be improved by buying (living in a home/area I’m happy in, able to enjoy city living, still being able to travel and eat out at will). I think this site does a fine job of portraying the market, as do others (including SocketSite).
If there is one thing that I haven’t seen reflected on any site though, it is a little psychology. I believe that the last 2 Bubbles happened when consumers ‘felt’ rich and thus supported the desire to take on risk. People initially felt rich in the tech boom because wages dramatically increased, then the stock market followed by shooting up in a crazed fashion. Buyers felt rich this last time around because of extraordinarily free flowing credit (thanks to the low interest rates and the support of mortgage backed securities), and drove up housing prices in record amounts. When the pipeline of perceived wealth starts to dry up people start to reevaluate taking risks so the market corrects itself. Will the SF market fall dramatically, scale down 5-10%, just stay stagnant or return to modest growth levels? Who knows? There are a lot of moving parts here, domestic and global. But in addition to educating myself about local markets and the financials supporting them, I can also look at my tech industry peers who are I guess what some would term ‘mid-range’ buyers (only 2x-3X SF’s median income without giant stacks of cash outside of retirement and investments). While we are living very comfortably, we also aren’t feeling very ‘rich’ in these rather uncertain times. It’s not very scientific, but it’s a good gut check for some. So is the sky falling? I believe not. But I do believe that people in general are operating much more conservatively and the market will reflect that.
SocketSite and other more “glass is half empty sites” make some very valid points about the SF community of buyers for the long term, but they also miss out on certain investor/buyer classes. Either way, it’s always interesting to read about different points of view.
my biggest beef with socketsite and why i chose not to ever go back is adam. he totally censors stuff out all the time. so lame! what’s the point of facilitating a discussion if your going to spend all your time making sure everyone agrees with you.
Socketsite is higlighting a $1,200+/sqft condo in One Rincon Hill, as a sign the market is weak b/c the owner is selling due to ‘personal circumstances.’
I don’t know about you guys, but anything more than $800/sqft in SOMA is OVERPRICED. Hence, it amazes me that people feel comfortable talking about $1,200/sqft without hurling at all :)
And hence, that is why I think prices are up at least 10% in SF. Hello people, $1,200/sqft next to the HIGHWAY????????????????? lol.
Socketsite censures a lot too, and their advertisers know it. I do feel bad for Adam, b/c he was in the finance industry and could have bought 5-6-7-8-9-10 years ago at 9, but chose not too. Now, he doesn’t even work in finance, which is booming. Poor guy. The site does have some good entries though.
Life is too short. I know 30 year old guys who are renting, rent control apatments… at age 30! That is not the quality of life I want to live.
Yes, RentsUP/MarinaPrime/HQ/SquawOwner/StanfordInvestor… etc… etc… would much rather be living the “quality life” of trolling craig’s list and various blogs using 10s if not 100s of handles to pimp 94123. CONGRATS!