Resetting DOM (Days On Market), Buyers speak up! ABC News Nightline is listening

We hit the local news scene, now we’re going national. We received a call from a Nightline reporter today and they’re looking for feedback and active buyers who have THOUGHTS ON RESETTING THE DOM (Days on Market) to give an old listing new legs.

Specifically, do you think it is fair or not to have seen a property as newly listed, watch it become a “Stalefish”, then see it again on the market as “new”?

Agents, buyers, and even sellers, please share your thoughts by commenting here, or clicking on “comments” below. Nightline is listening!

Contact us if you’d like to possibly appear on Nightline tonight or tomorrow Monday or Tuesday. They’ll be interviewing around 5pm 6pm tonight in San Francisco.

Fellow bloggers, please spread the word, as we know this is a hot button.

Although not local, Manhattan Beach Confidential has a good post on this very subject.

[Update:...and this just in, Kevin Boer of 3 Oceans Real Estate just put up a nice post as well. Thanks Kevin!]

53 thoughts on “Resetting DOM (Days On Market), Buyers speak up! ABC News Nightline is listening”

  1. i think it’s as dishonest as hell and speaks to the general lack of ethics and morals in our society.

    it’s really sad too,

  2. Really, why does this matter? The buyer doesn’t pay for the days on market, just the baths/beds/LR and etc.

    Products like Tide detergent have become “new and improved” dozens of times. Why should a property listing be any different?

  3. it’s the same thing as a realtor fluffing up a staged pillow for a sunday open house..”oh, look..it’s all new pillows..”

    yea, right.

  4. it’s a manipulation of data and is unethical. CM, it’s true, buyers are paying for the physical attributes, but there is nothing “new and improved” about a listing that has it’s days on market reset. instead, it allows an agent to come back on top of all lists, go on broker’s tour as “new” and falsely “market” as fresh, despite the fact that it’s the same ol’, same ol’.

  5. I’m just in the market for a single family home in San Francisco – and have to say that if I see a house has been on the market for a long period of time, specifically more than 2 months, I tend to believe the seller is soon becoming desperate and is willing to accept low offers. I could be wrong – but at this point, that mentality is dictating my search. With what appears to be a declining market, newly listed homes will likely remain on the market for a while, giving sellers an opportunity to learn the “true value” in this rough time.

  6. From the perspective of a buyer it is iffy, but from my perspective as a seller I want my agent to do what it takes to get me the highest price. If it is a “loophole” that can work in my favor, then so be it. As long as the buyer has an agent that is diligent and can check the DOM, what’s the problem. If my home shows up in searches again after being on the market 75 days, which it has because we pulled it for the holidays, then what’s wrong with that. I have to say, activity is much better now than it was a couple months ago, and we may be getting an offer. We never lowered the price, but hopefully they don’t know we were almost a “stalefish”. Fingers crossed.

  7. DOM manipulation is just a marketing tactic and should have no real bearing on the final selling price of a home if the markets are working efficiently. It’s a tactic designed to ‘fool’ the lazy buyer who doesn’t ask the right questions of their agent.

    When was the property last sold and for how much?

    What is the property listing history?

    What are the comps in the past 5 years for the surrounding streets?

    These three questions should be answered before even contemplating a offer. If the buyer’s agent knows the DOM was reset and doesn’t disclose this to the their client — than both agents are manipulating the buyer. This is wrong.

    I personally believe that the DOM reset tactic is mostly to garner attention from out of town buyers as any serious local buyer should have a better pulse on the market.

    Lastly, the only permissible DOM reset should come if the home-owner changes agents. Even still, getting answers to the above questions would flush out the true listing history of the property.

    Eddy

  8. “seller” – you shouldn’t be relying on “loopholes” to market / sell the house. Tell your agent to come up with some new ethical ideas!

    Goes without saying I think the resetting of DOM’s is yet another example of agents / realtors manipulating our MLS database /system. If priced right from the get go – this is still a quick market. Having a loophole that allows reductions or other data changes to reset the days on market is a glitch in the system. It’s pathetic that we as an Association abuse this glitch – “It’s not illegal – am I doing something wrong” Sort of embarrassing that unless we go out of our way as an Association to say, “This is illegal / unethical” we’ll take advantage of an obvious distortion of facts.

  9. As a real estate agent, my bias speaks loudly to the need of any buyer for a good agent. A professional agent will always examine the property history to make a careful valuation of any listing. From a sellers view if they were saddled with a poor listing agent, or insisted in mispricing the property in the first place, they deserve a second chance to go-to-market wisely.

  10. loophole:

    also synonymous with greedy, cheap, arrogant, sneaky, do-it-without-permits, slippery as a fish, do-whatever-I-can-in-life-to-get-what-I-want, unethical.

  11. The DOM changing can happen for a few reasons, some I see as justified and then some are total crap.

    To me the only justified one is if agent A tries to sell a house and then pulls it off the market and then agent B takes it on later and then sells it. In that situation agent B should not be penalized ‘on paper’. Also I guess if say a house was for sale and then fixed up dramatically then it could reset the dom since it is a highly modified property. But that usually happens over the period of a year and is pretty rare.

    The problem is when when Agent A puts a house up in August and pulls it in December for say 800k. Then in Jan Agent A re-lists the property for 600k and it sells in a week for 750k. The problem is not in the sale but the problem is it pads the agents ‘stats’ artifically. THEN people in the neighborhood get those beautiful shiny post cards from Agent A with something like ‘HOUSE ON MARKET 7 DAYS, 150K OVER, THIS MARKET IS HOT’.

    Stuff like this could directly influence a seller to go with an agent because the seller is like ‘WOW, that agent is good’ when they might not realized the house was really for sale for like 6 months and not the 7 days as advertised.

  12. To my naive eyes a term like “Days on market” indicates how many days that a property has been marketed. So if A property was on the MLS for 60 days, taken off and pocket listed on the realtor’s website for another 60, then put back on the MLS for another 20 days, DOM should be 100 days. In no time during those 100 days was the seller or seller’s agent not seeking offers; it was on the market continuously.

    Reseting DOM to 20 days due to the 2nd MLS listing is deceptive. If the MLS DOM becomes meaningless due to these reset tricks, expect that a 3rd party website will start tracking the real DOM. That’s the first step towards SFAR losing control of the MLS.

  13. It’s a violation of MLS rules in both Contra Costa and BAREIS. The history of the property’s marketing should reflect true and accurate information. ’nuff said

  14. the house and the price sell itself, not the days on market. if it ain’t selling, no amount of lying will fix it. rent it out or lower the price.

  15. This practice was more previlant a couple of years ago before our local mls instituted a two week moratorium between *taking* a property off the market and then being able to re-list it.

    There is also a property history available to see the mls activity on each listing.

    Smart agents and buyers know the inventory available; smart agents look for over priced, out-of-area agent listings which can represent an opportunity to negotiate a deal for their buyers. And smart buyers will wait out unrealistic sellers.

    “Loopholes” won’t sell properties; it’s still all about pricing, condition, location, easy accessibility to show, and marketing for the widest possible exposure.

    The mls is imperfect because you’ll find lots of little mistakes and omissions – there are probably one to two thousand people maybe more,, inputting information into the system – what’s the old saying, “garbage in, garbage out.”

  16. The price can sell itself, for sure. However its the stupid ‘post sale’ manipulation that really kills it. The ‘Start at 1 mill, drop to 750k, sell for 875 and promote as ’125k over’ is such a joke.

    In addition to days on market some site needs to scrub the mls and plot all the DOM’s and also the price’s as they change up and down. It would be great to pull up a house listing and see that it was re-listed 3 times in the last year AND also what the various prices were over that time as well. In addition to seeing the price change you can get an idea of what games, if any the Realtor is playing by upping and lowering the price. Then you can look at the sale price and see what the ‘original price’ was listed at vs history.

  17. It really doesn’t matter how many days the property is on the market. The

    bottom line is how much a buyer is willing to pay for it. The days on the market

    should never determine the price. Some of the best properties I’ve found for

    clients is stuff that somehow got missed. We sometimes have to take listings

    off the market and start again just to get agents to show it. Maybe some work

    was done; maybe some deals that were never posted and short lived. If another agent comes along and list the property fresh…it usually goes. Go figure.

    We need to educate our buyers and some of you newer agents…if you like the

    property, and it works for you at the price its listed for buy it. Have confidence

    in your decision thats ifs the right property for you. Who cares how many days

    its been on the market. Its shouldn’t be about bargin hunting…unless you are

    looking for a flip.

  18. DOM is not a mystery. If one agency does not sell it, it could go to another agency. That will resent to DOM clock. This is not a conspiracy to manipulate data.

    Your buyers agent check the sales history, it’s not a mystery.

    If agency A has it for 100 day with the wrong price and bad marketing, and it does not sell, then Agency B steps in, changes the look and feel of the home through staging and hoem improvemetns perhaps, and the odea beter job fo marketing, ( answers calls, holds open houses, etc.perhaps changes the price to refelct curent markt conditon and then sells it in 7 Days.

    Should Agency B says it took them 107 days to sell it?

    I do not think so. No.

  19. Kathleen -

    In your case dom is not a mystery but a lot of the time the same Realtor or one of the realtor’s buddies at the same company re-list a property after pulling it and claim a low DOM. That is complete manipulation, esp for the future home seller. If I visited an agent who claimed ’7 day average DOM’ I would think they were great. In this case its a total case of deception. Would somebody go with an ‘honest agent’ with a 145 DOM avg or the ‘stud’ with the 7 DOM record.

    If you change your agents obviously none of this stuff is relevant.

  20. Kathleen – that’s entirely different than Agency A pulling the unit from the market for 31 days and putting it back on the market. It’s different than Agency A pocket listing the unit for 60 days and then putting it on the market.

    If the brokerage is fired and a new one is hired, that would seem to be a reasonable reason for the unit / house to come on as new – it’s a new listing for that specific company. Obviously that’s not an agent tactic as the home will come on with a new agent – so unless the slimy agent is changing firms – which seems drastic for even a realtor – the new brokerage should get a new “days on market.”

    The pocket list / reduce in price / remove for 30 day tactic is more frustrating – and certainly an educated buyer and Realtor can dig up all the relevant info in order to make an educated offer. We do this all the time – for me the question is – why should we have to? Why do we choose the easy bullshit gimmick as opposed to being honest and ethical.

    Again – unless we have something in writing that specifically says “you can’t do X, Y, Z” – we find ways to abuse and trick the system – Shame on us.

  21. Hey ?? What happened to my 2nd post ?

    Are references to other RE blogs cause for censorship ?

    [Editor's Note: "Other" RE blogs...no. One in particular...yes. Because he does the same to us (among other things), and we've tried three times to settle differences and no reply. Until we hear back from him, expect any mention of that site to be zapped. Sorry.]

  22. yes they are. the editor is very testy about that. watch out.

    [Editor's note: For many, many, many, many good reasons. But, as stated, attempts have been made on our part to "move on", but not an inkling of a response. 'nuff said.]

  23. HoeGaarten – i briefly saw your post – SS does follow properties – they tend to choose the one’s that make it seem like the real estate market is about to POP which is far from fair – but it’s expected given the editor over there.

    [Editor's note: Now back to the topic at hand...resetting the DOM to reflect New On Market.]

  24. hoegaarten,

    you have far too much taste in beer to read the drivel on that other site. get with the program.

    ;)

    [Editor's note...again, and hopefully the last time ever: Back to the topic, resetting the DOM.]

  25. Might want to revise your comment policy accordingly –

    http://thefrontsteps.com/comment-policy/ [done]

    Back on topic — The more i think about this issue on DOM Manipulation the more I think that it is really a red herring. The bigger issue is that the buyer or seller must rely on a Realtor to unlock and possible hidden features or metrics in MLS. The MLS is very powerful and has a lot of useful information NOT available to the public. It may not be easy, but the savvy agent can pretty much uncover and dirt or baggage — and the real problem is that consumers are locked out of this information and the information contained within is used against the buyer. Consumers should be allowed to have full read access to the database on a subscription basis.

  26. Well, now it’s a month not two weeks. If a seller is willing to pull something off the market in SF for an entire month they should be allowed to put it back on as “new.” As someone said earlier, it is all relative. Buyers and sellers have divergent rationales.

  27. as a buyer, I was not so much concerned about the DOM – I think.

    what WAS worriyng me tho is “DOEmpty” properties – and specially for empty unheated unmaintained properties in the winter time.

    A property that has been waiting for occupants for more than 100days needs a price adjustment or additional mold, pest, rats, leaks etc inspection – while an occupied (or maintained) house that has been on/off the market for years wouldnt necessarily need the same caution.

    Like 300 sea cliff. Who cares if DOM is 392, 600 or (something close to 7 years if I’m right) or 12 days (assuming the whole remodel had been finished 12 days ago)?

    On the other hand the 198 judah (RANDOM pick! I dont mean anything else) listing mentions a “back on market” info that is relevant, because it could have been unheated for nearly a year – which would translate into possible damages to the wood panelings etc. (it’s then the honorable thing to do for the agent to be honest about those considerations – and update the disclosure package or whatever accordingly)

    [[[ ok - that seems "pathetic" regarding the SF market, but extended to the midwest, I would have a water pipe inspection for a property empty thruout the winter, while a new spring property wouldnt necessary need the same water pipes inspection. so DOM would be extremely relevant if property empty/staged etc ]]]

    so ressetting the DOM ethic? what about pocket listings which shows DOM=1 ? And shouldnt DOM start counting as soon as the agent gets the listing (for those who spam the world with pre-MLS “coming soon” postcards)? the debate could go on for years with each month bringing its own “totally out of pattern exception”.

    to be honest, I think that clients (buyers AND sellers) should be educated, and with a couple months of religiously reading blogs (included this one) and printing the sfnewsletter, they will figure out what is important to know, and what is irrelevant. I agree with Alex that most properties on the stale fish have nothing wrong, if maybe only the pricing, or/and extremely poor marketing. Quite the opposite; Why try to beat the crowd by overbidding on a new property when you can make a underasking offer on a stalefish with no pressure and no competition?

    When clients stop using blind criterias such as $/sqft, DOM and other biased property descriptions, and start doing the only way that works – aka leg work – every property eventually sell for its fair price, no matter the details.

  28. Kenny – If the property is really pulled off the market for a month then I can sort of see the rationale for reseting DOM. That means that for a month the seller neither solicits nor accepts any offers. That means taking down the “for sale” sign on the property and removing the property from all other marketing materials including the web.

    But who are we fooling ? It would be crazy for the seller to turn their back to offers. Especially if the property is vacant the carrying costs make it financially silly to take a property off of the market.

    I could certainly see the case of a homeowner who just wants to “take a break” from the open houses though.

    To those who are saying that DOM should not be a metric for the buyer to consider : why then even measure DOM ? If the number is meaningless then just get rid of it.

    DOM is not meaningless to the buyer and it has real value. Knowing the complete sales and marketing history of a property is useful. If SFAR does not step up and offer DOM stats, someone else will.

    [Editor' note: Thank you for getting back on topic. Can we buy you a Hoegaarten in the Biergarten for making our day?]

  29. I vote for transparency, but while statistics can help give you an idea of the market environment, the fact remains that each and every property has to be evaluated through inspections and disclosures and title (even brand new development) before a real decision on purchase price can be made on the part of a buyer. The buyer will determine the price they will pay and the seller will determine the price they will accept. Some sellers are not really serious, and overprice their property. Some sellers are extremely busy and the property is readily available to be shown (i.e., show it only 2 Sunday afternoons per month after 72 hours notice); these properties will be on the market for awhile. The DOM do not address all the complexities of people’s lives and thinking; you can’t boil all that down to a number.

  30. hoegaarten

    Your points are well taken. Like you said the ‘taking a break thing’ is pretty rare and the DOM does mean something to a lot of people. To the selling agent it means ‘great stats’ but to a lot of buyers, many who look on the mls for ‘sunday open houses’ the DOM will mean something. A lot of people, and myself during my first house hunt would automatically say ‘why has that house been on the market for so long, it must have issues.’

    If a house has a large DOM a lot of people question why. Its like the pretty girl or studly guy who is always single. People wonder why so long on the market.

    There are always people who ‘newly’ looking for property so when they see a ‘new’ listing they think it is new and might not realize it was for sale for the previous 6 months.

  31. Ideally, DOM would split into two: Agency-DOM, which starts the day an agent signs the listing, and Property-DOM, which would start the day an owner first puts it up for market, both would keep ticking every day it’s “on the market”, would stop ticking when it’s “off the market”, with the Agency-DOM resetting when the actual agency has been changed, and the Property-DOM resetting when the property has been sold. The only way this could work is both were mandated by state or federal law with severe penalties for manipulation.

    This would actually do a service to both buyers, sellers, and quality realtors. It would reward hard work and excellence, and punish laziness and greed, effectively making DOM the equivalent of a Restaraunt cleanliness rating: not perfect, but a thousand times better then not knowing at all.

    Buyers could know the true listing history of a property (without needing to rely on or wait upon a buyer’s agent that may or may not have the time or incentive to check as thoroughly as a buyer would) and sellers could guage the true effectivness of agents before getting trusting them with the sale of their most valued possession..

    This would also have the effect of making the market more efficient and keeping prices more closely aligned with demand, as seller agents would have motive to hit the target (maximizing revenue while reducing DOM), and not take on properties that are overly

  32. Oops. Damn cat.

    Continuing…

    This would also have the effect of making the market more efficient and keeping prices more closely aligned with demand, as seller agents would have motive to hit the target (maximizing revenue while reducing DOM), and not take on properties that are overpriced, Sellers would have motive to keep their prices realistic so that a sale could be reasonably be had in a reasonable time frame (and not damage their own DOM), and buyers could learn that there are good reasons for a high DOM that may represent real value to them (such as a remodel) which would result in a more constructive sales enviroment.

    Having a uniform audited DOM would also be tremendously helpful and useful for all parties from the perspective of running comps and other sales statistics.

    As it is now, and I’ve been quite vocal about this on this site before, DOM (as listed on the MLS) is completely 100% useless.

  33. missionite -

    good post. it would be ideal if you could look at property ‘history’ on the mls like a bank statement. something like

    ‘aug 16, 2006′ – listed for 400k by agent a

    ‘oct 16, 2006′ – price change to 450k by agent a

    ‘dec 16, 2006′ – mls expired

    ‘feb 16, 2007′ – listed for 370k by agent a

    ‘oct 16, 2007′ – listed for 340k by agent b

    This would be a super easy way for a potential buyer to view the actual history of the property in terms of price and agents. its not rocket science and would be really easy to watch the property trends. You could see the price and agent history all in one pop.

  34. Apparently SF is way behind the times. I just went to Kevin Boer’s site, as he posted on this topic (thanks Kevin), and an agent in Texas says they have ADOM and CDOM, or Active Days on Market and Cumulative Days on Market. As they say in the Heineken ads…”BRILLIANT!”

    Why do we not have something like that?

  35. That’s the first thing out of my buyer’s mouth these days. “How Many Days on Market?” We can’t forget that buyers are still getting even for the past 5 years when they bought homes as-is–no contingencies.

    We’re in the second act of a three act play and I haven’t a clue what the third act is. Maybe buyers and sellers will conduct thier own transaction and just give us a call to complete the paperwork. Now that’s a six percenter!

  36. Part of the due diligence for a buyer is researching the sales or business history (DOM, prior sales and prior prices, seller dynamics and motivation) as well as the structural integrity of the property. As an agent who works about equally with buyers and sellers, I investigate as much of the “business” history of a property as possible. As some posters have said there may be legitimate or scurrilous reasons for evaporating/re-setting DOM’s. Just like any statistic, it pays to look at all the data underneath before writing an offer or committing to purchase a property. The buyer’s agent and the buyer should look carefully at the property history among other things before discussing the optimal offer strategy to obtain the best possible price and terms.

  37. Hi everyone:

    This issue seems to surface every few months.

    In my mind, it is not as big an issue as many think.

    If a potential buyer is working with a knowledgeable professional agent who knows the local market, that agent will know whether the property was on the market 1 month ago or 3 months ago or 6 months ago.

    When I represent buyers interested in purchasing a house in a particular neighborhood, I make sure I send them ALL the market data for similar properties in that neighborhood typically back at least 6 months but often 12 months. I send them active listings, pending listings, sold properties and expired or withdrawn listings. So my buyer clients have the information they need to make an informed decision. So in my mind if seller agents want to play games with days on market, let them. These games will not fool knowledgeable buyers working with experienced professional agents. That being said, many mls services like REInfolink on the San Francisco Peninsula now have CDOM and DOM – cumulative days on market and days on market – so the data is readily available.

  38. Our MLS has changed vendors 2 times over the last 2 years. This has created a unique situation in Manhattan, Hermosa and Redondo Beaches,Torrance, El Segundo, Palos Verdes, and the Inglewood board. The DOM requlation hit us right as the market shifted. It definately confused buyers and sellers. Never stopped before was the “churning”,i.e. fake reasons to change DOM.

    Before that everyone thought something was wrong with the house…When the truth was enforced….a few agents figured a way around it and that is what is going on now. Most of us don’t change it and don’t know and don’t want to know how. Call it peer pressure to do the right thing. As we change to our new system we will learn to work within the regulations and that should even the playing field for the time being.

  39. Making a “stalefish” of a home on the market smell new again by resetting the DOM is misleading but only at first pass. Buyer-clients that have been looking for more than a week or so are savvy to that tactic. They’ll ask their agent for details and learn the history pretty quickly.

  40. I think you all are barking up the wrong tree. If anything do the ADOM, CDOM thing. But I can tell you that activity this time around on my home is way better than before. Changing the DOM seems to have helped my house out. Either that, or the economic stimulas has given buyers a kick in the pants. Regardless of the market though, what’s the big deal if this is done. So you relist and it resets the DOM. Big Deal. Disclose it already and move on. I can tell all you buyers that when it comes to sell your home, you’ll do almost whatever it takes (legally) to sell your home, and as far as I can tell, this is still legal so what’s the big f’ing deal?!

  41. If you are an agent, ask yourself, “Who am I working for?” ( Or if you are an English major…”For whom am I working?”)

    If you are working for the seller, you want prospective buyers to see the property on the MLS. DOM is not a consideration. Being seen is paramount. So, when the property is on the market for an overly long period or time, you cancel the listing and re-list it. “Churning” is what describes what you have done but it gets your listing to the front of the line. Are not listing agents supposed to do what is necessary to get the house sold? Isn’t advancing the listing to the front of the line so that it can be seen by prospective buyers a “fiduciary duty” of the listing agent? At least, I have heard that argument made.

    If you are representing the buyer, isn’t it your job (your fiduciary duty) to investigate the listing history of a property in which you client shows interest? Duh!!!

    Churning sounds ugly…rightly so…but resetting DOM is also a result of the limitations of the technology in our MLS systems. In a perfect world, DOM would be transparent and we would not be having this discussion. The world is not perfect!

  42. To those who suggest that it is in the best interest of sellers to reset DOM : if this practice were banned then the playing field would be leveled and there would be no need to play those games that just annoy buyers. Banning deceptive relisting would bring clarity to the market and would put sellers who have nothing to hide and those that do have something to hide at the same advantage. Why favor sellers who fool buyers ? If you’re interested in a fair market then who’s interest is it to obscure information and encourage chicanery ?

    To those who suggest that the status quo is just fine : just contract a knowledgeable realtor and they will release the “real” DOM figure : how does this benefit anyone in the market ? We’re just talking about a number. A number that the sfarmls.com database could easily produce without the need to insert a realtor in the loop. Certainly good realtors have better use of their time than maintaining their own personal record of subjective DOM.

    I’ve met enough realtors to know that there is plenty of value that they can provide to their clients. Knowledge of neighborhoods, trends, contract terms, etc. are valuable professional assets. These areas are where the finesse of a skilled realtor really add value.

    But being a gatekeeper for a simple DOM number ? No thanks.

  43. hoegaardan – I agree 100% with you. Of course I can dig through the property history and tell my buyers the actual number – but that’s not the issue. The issue is why we continue to take the short cut – continue to act in a manner that is far from honest – and then hide behind the bullshit “It’s not illegal” line of reasoning. It’s a joke – it’s why so many have ZERO trust in real estate agents and why so many call for radical changes to our industry.

    If you change brokerages – the new brokerage should have a new days on market – in my opinion that’s the only time it should reset.

    If you want to pocket list a property, advertise for months on your own website, spam the hell out of Craigslist with advertisements about the property — have at it. But when you decide to put the unit in the MLS – be honest and ethical and enter it with the appropriate days on market.

    What if I was to put a list of 10 properties on this site which have been pocket listed for 60+ days and ACTIVELY advertised on Craigslist as available – but are currently being marketed as “new on the market” in the MLS – What do you think the agents representing these properties would say, “It’s not illegal – what am I doing wrong”

    Who knows – perhaps our Association will take action and even the playing field – force all of us to play by the rules and not manipulate them.

  44. john juarez post brings up a personal problem i have with the industry at large. why have two competing/conflicting parties involved in a transaction trying to deceive eachother. maybe we should only have one realtor in a transaction, the sellers listing agent. make them liable for anything they fail to disclose. they do all the work anyway in getting listings. they should be compensated, not the buyers agent. this would reduce our transaction costs by 50% on deals. with the advent of things like open mls and the internet, do we really need buyer agents anymore?

  45. In my opinion this practice is aimed squarely at other realtors in the first place, not the consumer. I’m only speaking of SF, because that’s what I generally deal with. Here the object is to get the property back to the front of the tour sheet. A 5% price reduction or more will also merit that same status.

    Most people need buyers agents. Some are equipped to handle it by themselves. But the sheer amount of things they need to do, let alone the data they need to review, is going to be prohibitive for most people. Now, if you have your mind made up you want to live in a certain building come hell or high water? Hey, maybe you should go for it solo.

    There’s also this, what if the market changes back to a completely balanced or even a buyer’s market? All this bluster about DOM is going to fall by the wayside. If that should happens damn near every property is going to take a few months to sell. DOM won’t be relevant at all. They’ll all be at 60+.

  46. My 2 Cents

    I agree with most of what has been written. However, buyers and sellers both place too much emphasis on the DOM or CDOM. As mentioned above, DOM or CDOM is probably the least informative of the MLS data points. The data tells everyone how long a listing has been on the MLS. Nothin’ more and nothin’ less. It doesn’t tell how long it has been a pocket listing etc. (ie. on Craigs list, sing on front law indicating future listing “coming soon” etc.) It doesn’t tell whether there has been a price adjustment and it certainly doesn’t determine the value of the home. Its a data point that some (data geeks) use in an effort to have a measure of control over the purchase decision. Ie. if the home has been on the market for 90 days, it must be due a 5% drop. If it has been on the market for 120 days, an 8% drop and so on.

    Locally (and I imagine throughout the greater planet know as Earth), unscrupulous, unethical or poorly trained (ignorant?) agents use these tactics to create what the agent perceives as “new interest” in a property. In a warped sense they are acting as a fiduciary for their client by trying to keep the house in front of buyers in hope of getting the home sold. The reality is that any buyer who has been following the market (and if your buying a home and not following the market, shame on you) to any degree (either with or without an agent) would know that the home in question is being “gamed” by the listing agent. For the casual observer, the DOM or CDOM might confuse. It is unfortunate that some MLS’s don’t publish the CDOM data to the public. But even if they did, the value of DOM or CDOM is minor.

    One issue not mentioned is the seller has ultimate authority for the list price. Seller’s may want to “test the market” with a higher price. The listing agent needs to fully explain the pros and cons of such a strategy. Unfortunately, some agents may take an overpriced listing just to get the listing and then try to “assist the seller” in pricing the home correctly while the home sits and gets “stale.” New agents and agents of dubious ethics use this tactic to get listings. Any seasoned agent knows that this is a bad idea and against a Realtors code of ethics (yes we have a code of ethics). Note: not all licensed real estate agents belong to the California Association of Realtors, so those who aren’t CAR members are difficult to discipline for ethics violations.

  47. Totally unethical!

    DOM manipulation gets rolled up in the local and national housing statistics so who knows what the real market status is?!?!

    If its taken off the market for 6 months to a year or more, and something REAL done to change the property, that’s one thing. But a month or two? No way.

  48. Being New on the Market benefits Who? IF a buyer is looking long and hard they are well aware of how long that property has been on the market.

    If the Buyer has just come on the market and wants to make an offer on that property, they usually want to know how long it has been on the market? This will affect the offering price to the Seller. If the Buyer has just come on the seen and thinks the property has just come on the market, in my experience they will be willing to make a higher and faster offer than a property that the Buyer thinks has sat on the market for a long time.

    In my board in Palos Verdes, Calif. I am able to search the history of a property on the MLS. That way I can see how long the property has really been on the market. At least for Palos Verdes California, You can not hide the days on the market even if it says new. So just have your agent do their homework and New on the Market is no longer an issue in the Los Angeles Area.

  49. a 2 bedroom in my building just sold after 26 days on the market for 1.332 million. i have serious reservations about that dom figure however. the best part about it, they marketed it as a 3 bedroom.

    ;)

  50. buyers want accuracy in DOM listing b/c they want to beat the price down. if they cannot admit this they are only fooling themselves. if you want the place then figure out your price and bid.

    if you are looking in SF its not too hard to keep current b/c there is so little inventory. buyers are frustrated by the prices and will whine about every sort of issue but that will not bring the prices down. that’s the job of the market.

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